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From: owner-traveller-digest@mpgn.com (Traveller-digest)
To: traveller-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM
Subject: Traveller-digest V1996 #768
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Traveller-digest    Wednesday, December 18 1996    Volume 1996 : Number 768



(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.
All rights reserved.

The following topics are covered in this digest:

Response to Ken Whitman...
Re: Response to Ken Whitman...
Megatraveller
Starship construction figures
Re: Response to Ken Whitman...
Re: Response to Ken Whitman...
Re: T4 the Best?
Re: Megatraveller
Re: 3-siders (well actually d6 with 1-3 twice...)
Re: But It Doesn't Look The Way _I_ Want It...
Binders vs. Books
kEwL!!! a FlAmE wAr!!!!!!
Re: "Special Offers"
Re: Sector Data
Antimatter Space Propulsion at Penn State University
Re: Imperium Games, Starships, future products
Re: RCES LBD
Re: An idea for presentation/future books etc...
Re: Traveller-digest V1996 #763
Re: Response to Ken Whitman...
CORE: ADVANCED CHARACTER GENERATION - Tell Us All!

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 22:41:30 CST
From: Don McKinney <dmckinne@csci.csc.com>
Subject: Response to Ken Whitman...

I would like to be the first person to call for the reinstatement of the
X-boat mailing list, since postings which are not conforming to IG's views
are not acceptable here.

Do we need to vote for a list split?
- --
==============================================================================
= Donald E. McKinney, Senior CM Specialist, Communications Industry Services =
= (217) 351-8250 x2365  Computer Sciences Corporation  dmckinne@csci.csc.com =
= Official Kibitzer for Digest Group Publications    dmckinne@prairienet.org = 
=  Winter War XXIV Convention Chairman, February 14-16, 1997, Champaign, IL  =
==============================================================================

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 20:52:08 -0800
From: "Peter J. Miller" <PeterMiller@youngmerlin.com>
Subject: Re: Response to Ken Whitman...

At 22:41 17/12/96 CST, you wrote:
>I would like to be the first person to call for the reinstatement of the
>X-boat mailing list, since postings which are not conforming to IG's views
>are not acceptable here.

Wait a minute..who said that?  Ken posted HIS opinion, which, may or may not
be the list majority's view.  However, he is entitled to thgat opinon, and
if we can allr emember, is NOT representing IG in anyway.

I don't think we need a list split again, I think we're all adult enough to
rationally discuss things.

_______________________________Peter John Miller
"I'll sit around and stay a little longer...if they don't want me, I'll stay
at home and watch them" - Jays manager Cito Gaston on his future with the
team (12/12/96)
- ------------------------------------------------
Traveller, Prime Directive, AD&D, and the home of the Imperium Games FAQ!
       http://www.dragonfire.net/~pm/
Graphics Design and the _Lowest Prices on the Web_
       http://www.youngmerlin.com/	

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 23:16:19 -0600 (CST)
From: granthh@anubis.network.com (Harley Grantham)
Subject: Megatraveller

Can anyone tell me how many versions of the Megatraveller books were
printed?  I know there were many errors in the first editions, but I 
seem to have the 3rd edition which doesn't seem to have that many 
glaring errors.

Thanks,

- -- 
Harley Grantham					granthh@anubis.network.com

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 00:23:56 -0500
From: Thad Coons <104765.503@compuserve.com>
Subject: Starship construction figures

Hans Rancke writes:

<snip>

> A warship costs ~MCr0.75 per ton, so that would translate as 2 tons per
> month or 24 per year. Let's call it 25 T of ship per 100 employees.

> TCS says that a world's shipyard construction capacity is equal to 1
> ton per 1000 citizens (modified by the government modifier which runs
> from .50 to 1.2 in peacetime). 

<snippage>

I just went through the TL-15 ships in MT Fighting Ships of the Imperium,
and it appears that the average cost used in TCS is a truly gross
oversimplification. Among TL-15 ships, Tankers cost around .1-.2 MCr/T;
battle tenders and carriers at .3 MCr/T; light escorts in the .5-.75 MCr/T
range; light cruisers about 1.2 MCr/T; Fighters, Heavy cruisers, light
battleships, dreadnoughts, and light battle riders around 4-6 MCr/T; and
the heaviest craft with equally hefty price tages of 16-25 MCr/T.
Checking with TNE gives costs of around .5 MCr/T for the smaller civilian
types. Such variability in ship costs does bad things to your calculations
on shipbuilding capacities. 

If you keep your TCS assumptions of 1 T per thousand imperial citizens, and
use .5 MCr/T as an average base cost, you get annual shipyard capacity of
500 MCr per million citizens, or (for instance) 15 million MCr for your
world of 30 billion. Comparing that with MT's 3 million MCr for a 700 kT
Dreadnought gives a production figure I can live with. I think I could
accept figures and rates based on MT, TNE, or T4 ship prices.

Another thing that I overlooked is that the figures you have been giving
seem to be theoretical maximun values for production of one kind of craft
only. In practice, a world (left to itself) would produce a mix of
different kinds of ships, which means fewer of any given type.

Now that I'm more firmly convinced I mostly right all along :-), thanks for
the information and discussion. I admit to having been prejudiced against
TCS, and having an even worse impression when I saw some of your figures,
but it looks like only minor fixes are needed to make it sound and
compatible with later Traveller.

Thad Coons
http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/sapience/

 

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 22:32:27 +0000
From: "Suzette C. Dollar" <suzd@goodnet.com>
Subject: Re: Response to Ken Whitman...

> I would like to be the first person to call for the reinstatement of the
> X-boat mailing list, since postings which are not conforming to IG's views
> are not acceptable here.
> 
> Do we need to vote for a list split?

Don & Ken,

*Warning major RANT mode on * 

Both of you are speaking in haste and in anger.  There is no reason 
to vote for a net split because *ONE*  person who does not speak for 
IG or AP&D or SweetPea (read that Traveller) in any official capacity shoots 
off and tells everyone to shut up and stop bitching.  Seen IG's web 
page, since Dec 2?

I'll bitch at him, I'll bitch at you and I'll bitch at 
IG/AP&D/SweetPea if its appropriate.  Thats as much what this list is 
for as it is hooraying over the fact that a new version of Traveller 
is here and arguing relativistic rocks.

Personally, I am trying to support T4 as much as possible.  There are 
problems with T4, there are major problems with Starships.  I'll call 
a spade a spade.  But everyone else has already said what needs 
saying and I won't do the "me too" thing, wastes bandwidth, you know.

Now, as far as how we are representing ourselves to The New Blood... 
I do believe that is a concern.  But I will *not* impinge on anyone's 
free speech because I am concerned about how the newbies are going to 
react to my (or anyone else's) criticism.  Nor will I accuse anyone 
who criticizes a game they love enough to wade through this mailing 
list every day of not caring about it.

We *all* care.  We *all* want Traveller to do well.  We *all* want 
perfect products.  We may differ on what a perfect product is, but 
its what we want.  Which is why we are all here, and on #traveller, 
and harassing our local FLGS over when is <insert new IG product 
here> is coming in.  

Well, I've done my bitching for the year.  I'm going to get back into 
my civilized suit again and crawl back to #traveller where the flames 
are less intense.

OK, rant mode off.

Suz
suzd@goodnet.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 23:48:43 CST
From: Don McKinney <dmckinne@csci.csc.com>
Subject: Re: Response to Ken Whitman...

> > I would like to be the first person to call for the reinstatement of the
> > X-boat mailing list, since postings which are not conforming to IG's views
> > are not acceptable here.
> > 
> > Do we need to vote for a list split?

[well deserved flaming (on my part) deleted]

> Well, I've done my bitching for the year.  I'm going to get back into 
> my civilized suit again and crawl back to #traveller where the flames 
> are less intense.

Ok, I spoke in haste, and I apologize to the list.  God, I feel like I'm 
selling this game for IG, and they keep dropping the ball - and my morale
snapped.  Actually, I feel better being slammed for this - it tells me
others care too...

Thanks! (for the flame!)

- --
==============================================================================
= Donald E. McKinney, Senior CM Specialist, Communications Industry Services =
= (217) 351-8250 x2365  Computer Sciences Corporation  dmckinne@csci.csc.com =
= Official Kibitzer for Digest Group Publications    dmckinne@prairienet.org = 
=  Winter War XXIV Convention Chairman, February 14-16, 1997, Champaign, IL  =
==============================================================================

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 22:53:36 -0800
From: "Stuart L. Dollar" <sdollar@goodnet.com>
Subject: Re: T4 the Best?

On 17 Dec 96 at 10:38, William F. Hostman spewed:

> Once again, Kenneth and I are on opposite ends of the spectrum.
> Personally, for basic ruleset completenes, playability, and even
> editing, DGP did it best: MegaTraveller.

Huh?  MegaTraveller.  Are you playing the same game I run William?  
Are we talking about the Same MegaTraveller whose errata runs 25 
single space pages for the 3 basic books?  The MegaTraveller who as 
they were printed had a broken Advanched Merchant 
Character Generation system, a broken Starship Construction 
system, and a Starship Combat system that was totally useless as it 
was originally printed?  Don't get me wrong, I run a bug squashed MT 
as my system of choice, and probably will until the rest of the main 
body of T4 comes out, but compared to MT, T4 is bug free.

> The more I see of T4, the more I think Marc Miller hath made a HUGE
> mistake by not going with DGP for T4, or at least someone who was

Are we talking about the DGP of Joe Fugate, Rob Caswell, Mike 
Vilardi, et al, or the one of Roger Sanger?  There's a world of 
difference there, my friend.  The creative body of the DGP of the 
CT/MT days is LONG gone, and from all appearances, they ain't coming 
back.

> familiar with traveller. (No offense to the guys at IG, but y'all
> just ain't got traveller in your SOULS.)

Of course, the only way to interpret this statement is to take 
offense.  I dispute this statement, when you consider that a couple 
of IG staffers have worked on Traveller related stuff for GDW in the 
past.

> What's more, I think that T4 has been Totally integrety-challenged
> by IG's production schedule, editing, and such.

How does a production schedule challenge integrity?  Frustrate those 
like myself who placed orders, yes, challenge the integrity of the 
product?  Doubtful.  If anything, a slower approach to pushing new 
product out the door SHOULD result in a better product.  Editing, OK, 
but NO edition of Traveller has escaped editing problems, including the 
hallowed and holy little black books.

Stu
Stuart L. Dollar               sdollar@goodnet.com
Traveller referee since 1978, Official USENet 
spokesperson for Imperium Games
- ---------------------------------------------------
"Resistance to tyrants is obedience to God." 
- -Thomas Jefferson

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 23:04:13 -0800
From: "Stuart L. Dollar" <sdollar@goodnet.com>
Subject: Re: Megatraveller

On 17 Dec 96 at 23:16, Harley Grantham spewed:

> Can anyone tell me how many versions of the Megatraveller books were
> printed?  I know there were many errors in the first editions, but I
> seem to have the 3rd edition which doesn't seem to have that many
> glaring errors.

Loren could probably answer this one better, but there were 3 
editions put out of the MT rules, AFAIK.

The 1st edition, frankly, was atrocious.  25 pages of errata just to 
remove the errors.
The most glaring of the problems were:
Broken Advanced Merchant Generation
**Missing Special Duty Tables
**No Pilot Skill for Free Trader Merchant Characters.

Broken Starship/Vehicle Design
**Several bugs in numerical ratings for various ship components
**Several Columns in tables mislabelled.

Broken Starship/Combat Rules
**Combat rules mislabelled ranges for various sensors
**Some Combat Tables omitted

Broken Weapons Tables

The Second edition cleaned up some, but not all of the errors.
The Third edition were basically bug free.  A few minor problems, but 
nothing serious.

IMHO, even the Second edition of MegaTraveller was worse that T4 1st 
Printing.  It can be worse, and it has been in the past.

Stu
"Who owns a copy of 1st Edition MT, with lots of white out marks."

Stuart L. Dollar               sdollar@goodnet.com
Traveller referee since 1978, Official USENet 
spokesperson for Imperium Games
- ---------------------------------------------------
"Resistance to tyrants is obedience to God." 
- -Thomas Jefferson

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 17 Dec 96 23:56:16 -0500
From: eris@pen.net (Eris Reddoch)
Subject: Re: 3-siders (well actually d6 with 1-3 twice...)

On 12/17/96 at 04:52 AM,  34zbtxq@cmuvm.csv.cmich.edu (Susan M. Shock)
said:

> >Does anyone know of a mail order or online source for honest to goodness
> >D3's?

> Gamescience sells them , Chessex too I believe. 

I wasn't able to find a web site for Gamescience, and Chessex didn't show
any in its online catalog. <sigh>

> I bought three in Lansing MI, and plan on buying 3 more....Babylon
> Project uses 6d3 for it's task system (or will if it ever comes out!

Well, I could wait for B5 and buy that...maybe it'll come with the 6d3's in
it. <g>  Of course, that could be months! <bg>

Eris
- -- 
- -----------------------------------------------------------
eris@pen.net (Eris Reddoch)    using MR/2 ICE #245
- -----------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 01:19:32 -0500
From: "Harold D. Hale" <hdhale@siscom.net>
Subject: Re: But It Doesn't Look The Way _I_ Want It...

Ken Whitman writes:

>I understand your point.  However, few of our fans either choose not to or
>do not know how to use... Tact.  It is alright to say you are "disapointed"
>in certain aspects, however, T4 is bringing in new customers to this list
>everyday, and when they get on this mailing list all they here is everyones
>crap.

   This is a bastion of free speech.  Occasionally people vent their
spleens, but for the most part the posts are constructive.  Those that
get too far out of line hear about it, believe it.  

   It is assumed that the subscribers to this list realize that it
contains the good, the bad and the ugly in the way of Traveller and that
you are adult enough to know the difference and not get your feelings
hurt and take it all personally because somebody said a mean thing.  If
we disagree strongly at times, it is because we feel passionately about
a particular subject.  I hold no personal grudges because of something
that was said here, and I would expect that no one else would either.

>It is this kind of negative talk that will distroy the thing we all love,
>Traveller.  So when you deside to not like something, do Traveller a favor
>and use some Tact.  Point out the good qualities as well as the bad.  And
>if there we no good qualities then take the advice that was given to
>Thumper....
>
>...If you can's say anything nice, dont say anything at all.

   The day this list resorts to Politically Correct speech is the day I
will unsubscribe myself from it, permanently.  

   This is not a forum for generating sales.  People are going to give
their honest opinions of product because they want the product to be
better, or they want to express their pleasure with it.  If the comments
on product are generally negative, then it is because there is something
wrong with it--in our humble opinions.

>How you react may deternine the future of this game, and if you dont care
>about this game, then maybe you should find a game that means alot to you
>and find that maining list.

   Don't put the weight of Traveller's failure or success on our
shoulder's Ken.  Because if Traveller can be killed by our little group
of electronic know-it-alls, then it was going to die anyway.

- --Harold

------------------------------

Date: 18 Dec 96 17:36:34 +1100
From: Michael.Barry@FINANCE.ausgovfinance.telememo.au
Subject: Binders vs. Books

     I wasn't suggesting that binder pages be used *instead of* books. I 
     was suggesting the binder as a format for *cheap reprints* of the 
     books. So you still have a classic, collectors, book edition (which 
     looks good, has price/art/game system equivalent to industry 
     standards, everything that all you book fiends enjoy). 
     
     *Then*, perhaps six to twelve months later, a reprint in binder format 
     (perhaps as various folios eg character generation, ship design, 
     psionics and so on). These reprint folios (or loose pages...heck, what 
     about folios that you can take apart *if you want to*!) would be 
     priced much lower and produced pretty cheaply, to capture the market 
     segments: 
     
     a. Gamers that won't pay or cannot afford the glossy first printing 
     books, but will pay for a less expensive version. 
     b. Fans that bought the first book but now want a version *with the 
     errata corrected! *    ;]
     

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 01:41:09 -0500
From: rellio@po-box.mcgill.ca (Roderick Darroch Elliott)
Subject: kEwL!!! a FlAmE wAr!!!!!!

...ahem...

//unspeakable anklebyterness mode on


K00L!  tHe TmL iS DiSiNtEgRaTiNg iNtO a MuDSlInGiNg fLaMeWaR!  ThIs Is
AlMoSt As MuCh FuN aS tHe MaChO sTuDlY ElItE FlAmEwArRiOr sUb On ThE bBs I
uSeD tO cAlL wHeN I wAs 12!!!  WaY kEwL!

        wAy tO gO gUyZz!  AnYbOdY gOt AnY K00L WAREZ?!?!?!?!?!  Or GiFs oF
nAkEd BaBeZ?!?!?!?!?!?

//unspeakable anklebyterness mode off


        I'm going to go disinfect and exorcise my keyboard now, and then go
to sleep and pretend that Digest #767 never happened...

*-------------------------------------------------------------*
| Roderick D. Elliott... rellio@po-box.mcgill.ca              |
|                        elliot_r@lsa.lan.mcgill.ca           |
*-------------------------------------------------------------*
| "...an imperfect plan implemented immediately and violently |
| will always succeed better than a perfect plan."            |
|                        -Gen. George S. Patton.              |
*-------------------------------------------------------------*

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 02:36:19 -0500
From: BrianMays@aol.com
Subject: Re: "Special Offers"

In a message dated 96-12-17 16:49:01 EST, you write:

> Someone asked recently about the "Special Offer" items, such as the 
>  calendar, the t-shirts, etc. etc. etc. that are offered on IG's 
>  web site.  I just asked Ann what the story is on that stuff, and she said 
>  they're scheduled to be in stock by the end of December.  She also said 
>  that any charge orders placed for these items will not be processed 
>  until the items are actually being shipped to the individuals who 
>  ordered them.
>  
>  
>  -Joe

That was me, Joe.  And thank you for the info.  Perhaps some of my friends
will be getting belated Christmas presents . . .perhaps I'll just get them a
Hickory Farms Sausage Sampler and keep all the Traveller goodies to myself!
 AH HAHAHAHA!!

Ahem.

Brian

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 08:44:28 -0800
From: Harald Budschedl <Harald.Budschedl@mag.linz.at>
Subject: Re: Sector Data

Dhivael wrote:
> 
> Harald wrote:
> 
> >Is there any Sector Data of Core available (not just one Subsector as in
> >T4)?
> 
> In the same vein, I don't suppose there are any plans to reprint the
> "Atlas of the Imperium", are there? Preferably with big wall-filling colour
> maps, system details and, while I'm dreaming, different maps for the
> different millieus. :)
> 

Yes! Wow! This would be useful!!!

CyA
Buddy
- -- 
# Disclaimer: All opinions stated are only MY OWN.
# Harald.Budschedl@mag.linz.at 
# ADV - Anwendungsentwicklung
# Graphisch Technischer Bereich

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 18 Dec 96 09:05:11 -0800
From: Timothy Collinson <tc@library.solent.ac.uk>
Subject: Antimatter Space Propulsion at Penn State University

http://antimatter.phys.psu.edu/

This site might be of interest to some of you Travellers.


For any Brits interested, Virgin tell me 'Starships' was released day 
before yesterday.

tc

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 19:03:35 PST
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)
Subject: Re: Imperium Games, Starships, future products

In mail you write:

> I don't know how many starship deckplans I've seen that 
> have been drawn without any such facilities.  Of course
> humans may not need to go to the bathroom a thousand 
> years from now....

Well, the original Star Trek didn't have them either. And James Doohan
(Scotty) has (or used to have) a lovely explanation when fans asked
about it...

"Well, you see, we use the phasers to take care of that. You have to
aim very carefully, and we lose a lot of cadets during training.... "

:-)

- -- 
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 20:29:42 PST
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)
Subject: Re: RCES LBD

In mail you write:

> Also, to you jump guru's out there is there any rules laid down as to
> how a micro-jump works??  I hear about or see them pop up on the list
> every once in a while, but there are no rules for them in MT:TNE.
> Please fill me in.

A micro-jump works just like a jump-1 except that your target is a less
than 1 parsec away. Usually a lot less, and and it can be 0 (ie, you
pop back out a week later in the same place you started.

> The fuel used by all the starships is liquid hydrogen.  But to my
> understanding it takes great pressure, or very cold temperatures to
> keep hydrogen liquid.  How is this done.  It always says in the rule
> books that it's just liquid hydrogen, but never details the
> container/tanks/or freezers that it would have to be kept in.  Would
> it be in pressurized tanks, like liquid nitrogen or liquid oxygen??

Pressure *won't* liquefy hydrogen unless the temp is very, very low
anyway. Ditto for oxygen and nitrogen.

All gases have a set of related properties. One is the critical
temperature. That's the temp above which it is *impossible* to liquefy
the gas, regardless of the pressure. The pressure required to liquefy
the gas *at* the critical temp is the critical pressure. 

The critical temp for hydrogen is several hundred degrees below zero (C).
The critical temps for oxygen and nitrogen are higher but still more
than 100 below. The only "common" gases that have a critical temp above
room temp are things like CO2, chlorine, propane, freon, etc. 

So LH2 is *cold* (around 20 K or -253 C). Like all cryogenic gases,
it's kept in what amounts to a high-tech thermos bottle. In fact,
thermos bottles were originally invented to store liquid gases, and
then someone realized that if they'd do that, they'd do great at
keeping things like coffee hot or drinks cold.

The basic setup is a double-walled tank with a vacuum in between the
walls. The vacuum prevents heat transfer by conduction and convection.
The facing surfaces are polished and plated to give a mirror finish to
reduce heat transfer via radiation. Obviously, there do need to be
occasional "spacers" in-between the walls. You use things with *very*
low heat conductivity for such. 

There are also some insulations that have been developed that allow you
to fill a railroad tank car with liquid helium (at around 3 K) and ship
it clear across the US (say a week's travel) and only have the temp go
up by less than a degree. 

So keeping the stuff cold isn't a big problem. Especially in space.
It's the folks on the ground that have the real problems. In space, you
can liquefy hydrogen, or even helium simply by sheilding it from the
star and local planets, and letting it radiate its heat to empty space
(effective temp of the empty sky is 4 K). You have to be patient, but
it will work!

- -- 
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 21:07:05 PST
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)
Subject: Re: An idea for presentation/future books etc...

In mail you write:

> This is unfortunate, as I like the binder format, but one thing I see is it
> must be made single sided so that updates cn be added a lot easier than if
> it's double sided and thngs get out of order.

No, just do it the way IBM did (and for all I know still does) manual
updates for mainframe stuff. If the update requires something that
would go between the two sides of a page (say page 35-36) the update is
two pages (say 35-35a, and a 36 that's blank on the other side).

Once things get moderately ugly, they issue an update that's a
replacement for the whole chapter. For RPG stuff, you'd do it by
section or subsection.

- -- 
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 13:30:25 +0000
From: Andy Lilly <a.s.lilly@nortel.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1996 #763

Eric Freitas <edf@atlantic.net> said (about deckplan designs):

>Don't forget the bathrooms either!!!

The cabin design I use for the Lintula Sunrise has a composite shower/toilet
cubicle in one corner. I can't remember off the top of my head how much
detail I wrote into TLWH about it, but the toilet is a fold-out-of-the-wall
minimalist design. EVERYONE is expected to sit down at it, not stand (for
safety reasons and to allow a simple suction system [or something like that]
to remove the results). One could envisage long suction hoses being used for
certain purposes but I think after the first few law suits for damage to
sensitive organs (over-suction, blow-back, etc.) that these might be
discontinued! :-)

Covering things like this is a constant problem. The number of deckplans and
floorplans I've created 'on the spot' for my games and then realised that
there are no toilets, or that the hotel's dining room is on the opposite
side of the building from the kitchens, or...

Andy :-)

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 07:11:21 -0600 (CST)
From: "Joseph E. Walsh" <ransom@connect.iconnect.net>
Subject: Re: Response to Ken Whitman...

On Tue, 17 Dec 1996, Don McKinney wrote:

> I would like to be the first person to call for the reinstatement of the
> X-boat mailing list, since postings which are not conforming to IG's views
> are not acceptable here.
> 
> Do we need to vote for a list split?

Don't be silly.  IG doesn't own this list.  Besides, Ken Whitman has 
nothing to do with IG - as he recently posted, he's just here as a fan.  
He's given his opinion of how the conversation should proceed, and some 
people have responded.  I don't see a need to flee this list!


- -Joe
______________________________________________________________________________
Joseph E. Walsh      |  Atari 8-Bit User and Programmer Since 1982
ransom@iconnect.net  |  Classic Traveller Referee Since 1983
Stuck in the '80s    |  Microsoft-Free and Loving It! :)
       .....Official Reporter of Imperium Games Product Info.....

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 14:00:26 +0000
From: Andy Lilly <a.s.lilly@nortel.co.uk>
Subject: CORE: ADVANCED CHARACTER GENERATION - Tell Us All!

"Kenneth Bearden" <dreamer@brokersys.com> said (in response to K.C. Komosky):

>> No no no no! Don't bring back advanced character generation (BTW, its ala 
>> Books 4-7 for CT). While the characters that were created with Mercenary, 
>> HIgh Guard, Scout and Merchant Prince were very interesting, they were just 
>> too overpowering when compared to characters generated using the standard 
<SNIP>
>But, I also like the detail you get on a character when you create 
>him year by year.  My absolute favorite char gen system is the 1 year 
>method.

If you can generate a 1-year system that isn't _too_ much more work to roll
up, _plus_ gives you a better feeling for character background, and which
gives _equal_ skills to those in the basic T4 book (much easier than with
CT, since T4 has started off with 1 skill min per year), then I don't think
you can go wrong.

>I'd like to see a whole book with nothing but character classes, both 
>new ones and those from the main book, using the one year method from 

CORE is currently planning out a series of such books. The obvious question
is, what would you like to have in such a book other than the 1-year system?
More detail on the character _class_, or splitting major classes into
subclasses, or just adding lots of new careers? How about little things
specific to classes, i.e. special contacts or equipment - perhaps even
ships. Would you want to see career-oriented adventures (several A4 pages),
say 1 per career, or just plots that the ref' can flesh out? Would you want
the career detail to be Milieu-specific? How detailed do you want the career
description - i.e. a technical discussion of how the Imperial army's
organised, or just a brief bit of fiction describing a typical trooper in a
warzone.

TELL US WHAT YOU WANT AND WE'LL SEE IF WE CAN EXCEED YOUR EXPECTATIONS...

>> begin 600 WINMAIL.DAT
>> M>)\^(B0&`0:0" `$```````!``$``0>0!@`(````Y 0```````#H``$(@ <`

AAARGH! Don't keep his unwanted encoded RTF or whatever it is in your reply!!!!

Andy :-)

Oh, and a VYER MELLY CHSITMAS before I forget. Drinks with the customer? No
of course we never drink on business. Hic!

------------------------------

End of Traveller-digest V1996 #768
**********************************

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